Professional Football Researchers Association Forum

but there is a possibility that rather than a 5-5 balance of "new" seniors and call it "pre-50" seniors
could be as low as 2 for old and 8 for "newer" guys. Or 3-7 at best

Not surprising.

Ken Crippen wrote:Not surprising.

Concur. The best to hope for now might be a pre-50s threesome of Duke Slater, Al Wistert, and Lavvie Dilweg. I'll take that, if a bit reluctantly. Cross fingers.

bachslunch wrote:

Ken Crippen wrote:Not surprising.

Concur. The best to hope for now might be a pre-50s threesome of Duke Slater, Al Wistert, and Lavvie Dilweg. I'll take that, if a bit reluctantly. Cross fingers.

agree----like to see Ox get a serious look, too, but beggars can't be choosers. Heard Lewellen and Dilwig (two Packers could cancel, which would suck)

oh well

bachslunch wrote:

Ken Crippen wrote:Not surprising.

Concur. The best to hope for now might be a pre-50s threesome of Duke Slater, Al Wistert, and Lavvie Dilweg. I'll take that, if a bit reluctantly. Cross fingers.

i concur with bachs which pre 50s player would you take over dilweg?

I'll throw my opinion in the mix. For HOF, right? Obviously I'd love to see Spec lol, but I know I'm never gonna get him. Other than him, the pre-50s guy I'd most want to see is probably Jim Benton. Now idk enough about Wayne Millner to judge his worthiness as a HOFer, but him getting in early and not Benton is awfully weird. Was it just Rams SE overload with him, Fears, and Hirsch?

JameisLoseston wrote:I'll throw my opinion in the mix. For HOF, right? Obviously I'd love to see Spec lol, but I know I'm never gonna get him. Other than him, the pre-50s guy I'd most want to see is probably Jim Benton. Now idk enough about Wayne Millner to judge his worthiness as a HOFer, but him getting in early and not Benton is awfully weird. Was it just Rams SE overload with him, Fears, and Hirsch?

Millner is often referred to as one of the weakest HOF selections from the early years.

In a lot of ways, the early 50's Rams were the Greatest Show on Grass, a precursor to the late 90's teams. It was the first true vertical passing game the NFL had ever seen. But Benton pre-dated those glory teams, as he retired in 1947.

Benton's career, in my opinion, does merit HOF enshrinement. When he retired after the 1947 season, he held two of the three highest receiving yardage seasons (1945 and 46) in NFL history since 1933, only behind Hutson's 1942 season. His career YPC of 16.7 is in the top 80 all time, which is good. Hall of Fame all-1940's team, which is a nice bullet point on his resume. Seven times Benton finished in the top five in the NFL in receptions, six times finished in the top five in receiving yards, and in 1945 was the second player after Hutson to break the 1,000-yard receiving barrier. Five times in the top three in the NFL in TD catches, and six times in the top five in YPC in the league. Led the NFL in Yards from Scrimmage in 1945 and 1946. Second team All-Pro teams in 1944, pretty much consensus All-Pro in 1945 and 1946. He won two NFL championships, with the Bears in 1943 and Rams in 1945. Benton wasn't much of a factor in the 1943 Title game, but in frigid conditions (zero degrees) in Cleveland for the 1945 Championship game he came up big, catching 9 passes for 129 yards and a TD.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... ntJi00.htm

Millner seems almost like the voters were trying to answer the question, "Who was Sammy Baugh throwing all those yards to anyways? There has to be someone...", and they came up with him, even though there was really no answer; Baugh was actually very self-sufficient and never produced a number one target, spreading his yards out evenly to 4 or 5 different players every year. Neither did Luckman. This is a common trait in truly elite QBs to this day, although many have certainly produced great receivers as well.

As for Benton, I feel like if Hirsch had never had 1951, Benton would have gotten in long ago. The reason he got passed on was probably because the voters looked at his, Hirsch's, and Fears' stats, and his were the lowest, and with era-adjustment not yet that well understood at the time, he was the odd man out. Hirsch didn't have a HOF resume other than that year and clearly got in on it, so if he never had it, he'd have been the one passed on. Fears would still get in, and then Benton likely wouldn't have been so much the forgotten man among the Rams split ends. It's funny how one event that had nothing to do with him is almost certainly a major reason why he didn't make it.

Rupert Patrick wrote:

JameisLoseston wrote:I'll throw my opinion in the mix. For HOF, right? Obviously I'd love to see Spec lol, but I know I'm never gonna get him. Other than him, the pre-50s guy I'd most want to see is probably Jim Benton. Now idk enough about Wayne Millner to judge his worthiness as a HOFer, but him getting in early and not Benton is awfully weird. Was it just Rams SE overload with him, Fears, and Hirsch?

Millner is often referred to as one of the weakest HOF selections from the early years.

In a lot of ways, the early 50's Rams were the Greatest Show on Grass, a precursor to the late 90's teams. It was the first true vertical passing game the NFL had ever seen. But Benton pre-dated those glory teams, as he retired in 1947.

Benton's career, in my opinion, does merit HOF enshrinement. When he retired after the 1947 season, he held two of the three highest receiving yardage seasons (1945 and 46) in NFL history since 1933, only behind Hutson's 1942 season. His career YPC of 16.7 is in the top 80 all time, which is good. Hall of Fame all-1940's team, which is a nice bullet point on his resume. Seven times Benton finished in the top five in the NFL in receptions, six times finished in the top five in receiving yards, and in 1945 was the second player after Hutson to break the 1,000-yard receiving barrier. Five times in the top three in the NFL in TD catches, and six times in the top five in YPC in the league. Led the NFL in Yards from Scrimmage in 1945 and 1946. Second team All-Pro teams in 1944, pretty much consensus All-Pro in 1945 and 1946. He won two NFL championships, with the Bears in 1943 and Rams in 1945. Benton wasn't much of a factor in the 1943 Title game, but in frigid conditions (zero degrees) in Cleveland for the 1945 Championship game he came up big, catching 9 passes for 129 yards and a TD.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... ntJi00.htm

you make excellent points rupert

JohnTurney wrote:agree----like to see Ox get a serious look, too, but beggars can't be choosers. Heard Lewellen and Dilwig (two Packers could cancel, which would suck)

oh well

Let's fire this back up. Lewellen vs. Dilweg - one probably has a good chance, but I doubt both. Which are we supporting, and why? At first glance I'd say Lewellen, over 50 total TDs is absolutely no joke for the 20s.