Professional Football Researchers Association Forum

Hey all, I’m wondering what people’s opinions are of second team all-pros, and how much weight should be accorded to them when analyzing players’ HOF cases.

I personally give them a decent amount of weight, even though they’re just given to the runners-up in the all-pro voting instead of actually being elected spots in and of themselves, as I think it’s often meaningful to be the most popular second choice (i.e. a player factors prominently in the discussion when it comes to who is the best).

What are your thoughts and arguments as to why those do or don’t matter?

rebelx24 wrote:Hey all, I’m wondering what people’s opinions are of second team all-pros, and how much weight should be accorded to them when analyzing players’ HOF cases.

I personally give them a decent amount of weight, even though they’re just given to the runners-up in the all-pro voting instead of actually being elected spots in and of themselves, as I think it’s often meaningful to be the most popular second choice (i.e. a player factors prominently in the discussion when it comes to who is the best).

What are your thoughts and arguments as to why those do or don’t matter?

I don't know that all voters agree, but they to matter. Joe Horrigan emphasized the value of them to voters when Ozzie Newsome was up for election. He said it "explained the gaps in honors" in is career.

Sometimes a 1st teamer might have 29 votes and a second-teamer 20. That, to me, is a "higher 2nd team" than say someone who gets maybe 40, then 5, then someone else with 3, 2,1 ===

But again, 2nd team, to me is harder to achieve than a Pro Bowl in a lot of ways. I rate it between 1st team and 1st team Pro Bowl/All-conference

When comparing players at the same position it could be useful to voters. Look at the safeties. In terms of honors, how do people separate?
Atwater and Lynch have gotten pretty far, making FInal 15 and even Final 10. They also have the most Pro Bowls. And Pro Bowls are on the
the low side of honors, especially when they are not starters and voting by fans is part of the mix

LeRoy Butler and Darren Woodson have the "All-Pros"--more 1st and 2nd team ALl-Pros than Atwater and Lynch so why have the later two
done better than the former two? To me, only in terms of honors Butler and Woodson > than Atwater and Lynch

Four-time First-team All-Pro, but just 4 Pro Bowls. But to counter Pro Bowls
there are the five 2nd team All-Pro seasons, for a total of 9 1st or 2nd team picks
Nine is a very high number. 4 Pro Bowls is not high...it's okay

Then, moving to team performance, Lions a good defense while Karras was there
and he was a top pass rushing tackle....one of the best

So, to me, maybe the 5 2 team picks are a difference-maker? Puts him over
the top.

I agree that second-team all-pro honors are meaningful. I don't put much into Pro Bowls because in today's game, it's more of a popularity contest than a true honor, in my opinion. For instance, Ben Roethlisberger was the NFL's leading passer last season. He wasn't even selected to the Pro Bowl. REALLY???

All-Pro you really have to be top two at your position to be named. So it sure counts for me.