Professional Football Researchers Association Forum

Two questions. First, am curious to know the blocking ability (or lack thereof) for various HoF and HotVG tight ends. Best as I can tell, the following were good blockers:

Mike Ditka
John Mackey
Dave Casper
Mark Bavaro
Ron Kramer

and the following were not:

Kellen Winslow
Ozzie Newsome
Shannon Sharpe
Tony Gonzalez
Jerry Smith

I could be wrong on these, though, and would happily be corrected by those more knowledgable. Don't know anything about the blocking abilities for the following:

Jackie Smith
Charlie Sanders
Ben Coates
Todd Christensen
Pete Retzlaff

and would like feedback on their capabilities.

Second question: have seen occasional pushing of a HoF case for Russ Francis. I don't see any rationale for it, myself. Seems more like a 'Niners homer type thing more than anything else. Thoughts on this also welcome.

bachslunch wrote:Two questions. First, am curious to know the blocking ability (or lack thereof) for various HoF and HotVG tight ends. Best as I can tell, the following were good blockers:

Mike Ditka
John Mackey
Dave Casper
Mark Bavaro
Ron Kramer

and the following were not:

Kellen Winslow
Ozzie Newsome
Shannon Sharpe
Tony Gonzalez
Jerry Smith

I could be wrong on these, though, and would happily be corrected by those more knowledgable. Don't know anything about the blocking abilities for the following:

Jackie Smith
Charlie Sanders
Ben Coates
Todd Christensen
Pete Retzlaff

and would like feedback on their capabilities.

Second question: have seen occasional pushing of a HoF case for Russ Francis. I don't see any rationale for it, myself. Seems more like a 'Niners homer type thing more than anything else. Thoughts on this also welcome.

I think your first two lists are quite accurate and I would say that none of the TEs on your third list was a particularly good blocker.

Francis was a very good blocker when he felt like it, but very often he didn't feel like it. I'd put Kramer in the HOF before Francis, and I'm not banging any drums for Kramer.

bachslunch wrote: Second question: have seen occasional pushing of a HoF case for Russ Francis. I don't see any rationale for it, myself. Seems more like a 'Niners homer type thing more than anything else. Thoughts on this also welcome.

I haven't seen much of a push in 'Ninerland for Russ Francis but there was a local movement last year to get John Brodie nominated by the Senior Committee. Brodie is in declining mental and physical health and it was hoped, to little avail, that he might be so recognized.

I think, to some degree, there is the thinking that the 49ers were the "Team of the '80's" and that, therefore, they should have as many HoF representatives as the teams of the '60's or '70's.

I remember asking here several years ago who else from the 80's 'Niners might be inducted and the consensus was "None."
Since then Fred Dean and Charles Haley (90's) have been inducted.

It will be interesting to see what 49ers are considered Hall-worthy as time passes and perspectives change.
Perhaps with the passing of time players like John Taylor, Randy Cross or Keena Turner will seem more attractive than they do today.

Prior to the 1968 Draft, Charlie Sanders' blocking skill was seen as one of his assets.

A 1978 article about Jackie Smith noted a Mike Ditka comment about him: "he was never really known as a blocker." Yet during that season, Smith was used primarily as a blocker. Prior to SB XIII, his hands were always seen as reliable.

Christensen was drafted by the Cowboys as a fullback if I recall.

As far as Ozzie Newsome, he was a WR at Alabama and had good enough hands that his blocking skills weren't all that important.

JuggernautJ wrote:I think, to some degree, there is the thinking that the 49ers were the "Team of the '80's" and that, therefore, they should have as many HoF representatives as the teams of the '60's or '70's.

I remember asking here several years ago who else from the 80's 'Niners might be inducted and the consensus was "None."
Since then Fred Dean and Charles Haley (90's) have been inducted.

It will be interesting to see what 49ers are considered Hall-worthy as time passes and perspectives change.
Perhaps with the passing of time players like John Taylor, Randy Cross or Keena Turner will seem more attractive than they do today.

My guess is that Roger Craig may be the most likely 'Niner of the time not in to make the HoF, though as a Senior well down the road. He is on an all-decade team and the mythology around the 1000/1000 season he had remains fairly thick. I'm not so impressed, myself. Randy Cross and Michael Carter have profiles of 3/3/none and Guy McIntyre's is 0/5/none which isn't all that great, though it beats Keena Turner's 0/1/none, Harris Barton's 2/1/none, Eric Wright's 1/2/none, Dwight Hicks's 1/4/none (and short career), or John Taylor's numbers. Besides Russ Francis, have seen people push for other really off the wall possibilities like Tom Rathman or Jack Reynolds. Not taken with any of them, myself.

John Brodie and Roman Gabriel are arguably the best QBs not named Ken Anderson outside of the HoF. Not sure how enthusiastic I am about either of them, though, given how heavily represented the position is.

BD Sullivan wrote:
Christensen was drafted by the Cowboys as a fullback if I recall.

As was Pete Retzlaff. Retzlaff also was a split end with Philly before he became a tight end, the switch suggests that he might have been a good blocker.

Sorry since this was meant to be a TE thread, but seeing Brodie mentioned made me think of this: http://www.footballperspective.com/the- ... -rankings/

I didn't think Gonzalez was a terrible blocker. He was definitely below average in that aspect during his first couple seasons. (IIRC, he also had a problem with dropped balls his second season. Media members were saying he had bad hands. That seems funny in retrospect) But Gonzalez worked hard to improve as a blocker. I did a quick web search, but didn't find much conclusive evidence.) There was a PFF blog circa 2012 that rated pass blockers. Gonzalez gave up only 1 pressure on the 50 times he pass blocked that season, a 98% success rate that placed him 7th among TE's. (FWIW, he had more pass blocking plays then any of the 6 above him.)


As a run blocker, I recall being impressed with Gonzalez during the 56-10 blowout of Atlanta. I figure he had to be at least average blocking for Priest Holmes and Larry Johnson to produce like they did.

Dr. Z, who gravitated towards picking players who could mix it up in the trenches, selected Gonzalez for his All Pro Team 4 times in the five years between 1999 and 2003. Z never specifically mentioned Tony's blocking ability, but if he had been deficient, I find it hard to believe Z would have selected him.

Jackie Smith, like Rushh Francis, did a good job when he wanted to, very tough guy, but like to catch ball more. But he could get it done.

bachslunch wrote:Best as I can tell, the following were good blockers:

Mike Ditka
John Mackey
Dave Casper
Mark Bavaro
Ron Kramer

Where do all of you place Heath Miller, strictly as a blocker that is, among these guys?