Professional Football Researchers Association Forum

HBGFBFAN wrote:Who else was considered this year?

I am wondering the same thing. Does anyone have a list of the other thirteen who were considered?!?

Stabler's tanking started with the Raiders in 1978, with 16 TD passes and 30 INT's. Stabler and Jack Tatum both attributed that partially to the upheaval at wide receiver and offensive line, and that half his interceptions were pop ups. Stabler's stats improved in 1979. His passing yards were a career high, which is only partially attributable to the 16 game season. He had more yards per game in 1976.

SixtiesFan wrote: It's also forgotten that Stabler beat out Lamonica in the 1972 preseason and started the opener in Pittsburgh. He faltered and Lamonica started the rest of 1972. Ironically, Stabler replaced Lamonica in the Immaculate Reception game and put the Raiders ahead 7-6 before the spectacular finale.

What really amazed me about the '72 season opener, when I first saw the GoTW program several few years ago, was that Madden actually sent Blanda in to replace Stabler. Lamonica entered the game as the third QB. Daryle then led the Raiders to three 4th qtr TDs. It wasn't enough to complete the comeback, in a 34-28 loss, but it was enough to win his job back.

How did Daryle drop to third string on the depth chart prior to the game? Did he have an injury? A terrible preseason?

To the topic at hand; the choices of Stabler and Stanfel are laughable.

Stabler beat out Lamonica during the preseason, but I'm guessing Madden was trying to go back to the well with Blanda, who was actually celebrating his 45th birthday that day. That's because an article the day before the game noted that Lamonica was second string.

The biggest concern regarding Ken Stabler and the HoF for me revolves around questions on gambling, point shaving, and the like. But the more I delve into the history of other HoF members, there seem to be a number of enshrines with "issues," including several owners (Paul Hornung, Bobby Layne, Joe Schmidt, Len Dawson, Tim Mara, Charles Bidwill, Bert Bell, Art Rooney). I'm seriously thinking that ship has sailed for the PFHoF.

Without this issue, I'm pretty lukewarm on Stabler as is, but I can see a weak case for him -- and since they've already gone and nominated him, I'd be thinking "okay, just get him and Stanfel in already -- it's all the more reason Ken Anderson and Jerry Kramer should be in ASAP."

Not that this makes either a very good nominee, but maybe they both should be voted in. Not the best criteria, for sure, but what else can one do?

by bachslunch » Sun Aug 23, 2015 7:32 am
"The biggest concern regarding Ken Stabler and the HoF for me revolves around questions on gambling, point shaving, and the like. But the more I delve into the history of other HoF members, there seem to be a number of enshrines with "issues," including several owners (Paul Hornung, Bobby Layne, Joe Schmidt, Len Dawson, Tim Mara, Charles Bidwill, Bert Bell, Art Rooney). I'm seriously thinking that ship has sailed for the PFHoF..."

Bell, Mara, and Rooney were not involved with organized crime.
They liked to watch the ponies run and see some stuck-up jockey boy settin' on Dan Patch.
Of course they went to the betting windows but that's like a Grandmother playing BINGO on a Saturday night.

If the others went to Las Vegas or the Riviera or London, or if there was OTB, there would be nothing wrong with that.
But, they were not little old ladies putting a nickel on the daily number.
They made hefty bets with illegitimate bookmakers and the only people that cover those bets are gangsters.

This is not to say this trinity was of angels but they are unjustly grouped with those who favored the criminal element.
Additionally, it was Bert Bell who initiated the first vigorous anti-gambling policy in the NFL.

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by JohnH19 » Sat Aug 22, 2015 5:49 pm
"...To the topic at hand; the choices of Stabler and Stanfel are laughable."

If there were not far better qualified candidates waiting in the mix, it might be laughable.
A mere cursory glance at those ignored make the choices pathetic.
With Stabler, it is the LIFO over FIFO method of inventory.
Last in the grave, first in the hall (and let's give him some company.) Sad!

Len dawson should not be included. He was cleared before SBIV

oldecapecod11 wrote:by bachslunch » Sun Aug 23, 2015 7:32 am
"The biggest concern regarding Ken Stabler and the HoF for me revolves around questions on gambling, point shaving, and the like. But the more I delve into the history of other HoF members, there seem to be a number of enshrines with "issues," including several owners (Paul Hornung, Bobby Layne, Joe Schmidt, Len Dawson, Tim Mara, Charles Bidwill, Bert Bell, Art Rooney). I'm seriously thinking that ship has sailed for the PFHoF..."

Bell, Mara, and Rooney were not involved with organized crime.
They liked to watch the ponies run and see some stuck-up jockey boy settin' on Dan Patch.
Of course they went to the betting windows but that's like a Grandmother playing BINGO on a Saturday night.

If the others went to Las Vegas or the Riviera or London, or if there was OTB, there would be nothing wrong with that.
But, they were not little old ladies putting a nickel on the daily number.
They made hefty bets with illegitimate bookmakers and the only people that cover those bets are gangsters.

This is not to say this trinity was of angels but they are unjustly grouped with those who favored the criminal element.
Additionally, it was Bert Bell who initiated the first vigorous anti-gambling policy in the NFL.

"Interference" by Dan Moldea states (maybe wrongly?) that Bell was an associate of mobster Frank Erickson early on. No question he later went out of his way to try and clean up the league of mob ties and gambling issues.

And while Mara probably didn't have mob ties, he was a (legal) bookmaker. Rooney likewise likely didn't have mob connections, but he bought the Steelers with money won scoring big at gambling. Not exactly granny bingo, for sure.

John Maxymuk wrote:Len dawson should not be included. He was cleared before SBIV

True, but he was considered a close friend of Donald "Dice" Dawson (who also had ties to folks like Karras and Layne), and there were definite questions about just what that relationship entailed. Maybe not so different from Stabler and Nick Dudich? Maybe they were both just friends as well?

Also interesting: over at the PFHoF website are three short interviews with Senior committee member John McClain:

http://www.profootballhof.com/enshrinem ... finalists/

Some interesting things said:

--there were 16 finalists this year.

--there are about 60 names under general consideration at this time.

--the mission seems to be to get in these neglected players from the '50s and '60s.

--there seems to be a real need to educate the voters about the fitness of the Senior candidates being presented.

Couple of thoughts:

--that doesn't sound too encouraging for deserving folks from the '20s, '30s, and '40s (Wistert, Dilweg, Slater, Lewellen, Matheson, Emerson, etc.).

--the Senior committee seems concerned about some of their nominees being voted down (Humphrey? Stanfel?) and may arm-twist harder on behalf of the nominees. Perhaps that's why we saw Humphrey and Stanfel come up again so soon, to make a more forceful push?