Professional Football Researchers Association Forum

Ness wrote:The quarterbacks have been revealed:

Baugh, Brady, Elway, Favre, Graham, Manning, Marino, Montana, Staubach, Unitas

Personally, I like my list better:

Unitas, Baugh, Graham, Montana, Brady, Manning, Marino, Brees, Starr, and Staubach.

Elway was a surprise. I initially didn't think Favre would make it, but I could see it maybe. I think Starr should have taken his spot, but I guess Unitas covers the dominance from the 1960's. So no Starr or Dawson.

Ness wrote:The quarterbacks have been revealed:

Baugh, Brady, Elway, Favre, Graham, Manning, Marino, Montana, Staubach, Unitas

Personally, I like my list better:

Unitas, Baugh, Graham, Montana, Brady, Manning, Marino, Brees, Starr, and Staubach.

Elway was a surprise. I initially didn't think Favre would make it, but I could see it maybe. I think Starr should have taken his spot, but I guess Unitas covers the dominance from the 1960's. So no Starr or Dawson.

7DnBrnc53 wrote:Here is my list:

Baugh, Unitas, Graham, Montana, Elway, Marino, Peyton, Rodgers, Young, Staubach

I don't include Brady because he is a cheater. Also, Brees is a product of the modern passing game. There are people out there who have him ahead of Elway. That is beyond laughable.

JameisLoseston wrote:

7DnBrnc53 wrote:Here is my list:

Baugh, Unitas, Graham, Montana, Elway, Marino, Peyton, Rodgers, Young, Staubach

I don't include Brady because he is a cheater. Also, Brees is a product of the modern passing game. There are people out there who have him ahead of Elway. That is beyond laughable.

At this point all there is to say about this is that it's a generational gap that cannot be reconciled, and is brought on not only by who you grew up watching, but by what analytical standard you grew up applying to QBs. Essentially, it's a referendum on "what constitutes a great day for a QB more to you, a 4th quarter comeback or 500 yards and 4 TDs regardless of outcome?". For me, the latter is a no-brainer, ergo Marino/Brees over Elway is as well, but individual dominance seems to take lesser priority for old-school fans, of whom I am not one (currently in college). I wonder if a similar generational divide exists in who would support a guy like Eli Manning as a worthy HOFer. After watching him languish on waiver wires for years, I think his candidacy is a joke, but someone else will come and say zOmG hE bEaT tHe PaTrIoTs TwIcE!!!11!1!

7DnBrnc53 wrote:

JameisLoseston wrote:

7DnBrnc53 wrote:Here is my list:

Baugh, Unitas, Graham, Montana, Elway, Marino, Peyton, Rodgers, Young, Staubach

I don't include Brady because he is a cheater. Also, Brees is a product of the modern passing game. There are people out there who have him ahead of Elway. That is beyond laughable.

At this point all there is to say about this is that it's a generational gap that cannot be reconciled, and is brought on not only by who you grew up watching, but by what analytical standard you grew up applying to QBs. Essentially, it's a referendum on "what constitutes a great day for a QB more to you, a 4th quarter comeback or 500 yards and 4 TDs regardless of outcome?". For me, the latter is a no-brainer, ergo Marino/Brees over Elway is as well, but individual dominance seems to take lesser priority for old-school fans, of whom I am not one (currently in college). I wonder if a similar generational divide exists in who would support a guy like Eli Manning as a worthy HOFer. After watching him languish on waiver wires for years, I think his candidacy is a joke, but someone else will come and say zOmG hE bEaT tHe PaTrIoTs TwIcE!!!11!1!

Dominance is good. However, you only look at stats, not what's behind those stats. Today's football is special ed compared to the past. It's much easier for QB's now than it was in the 80's and 90's. Defenses today are neutered. 500 yards and 4 TD's against neutered defenses isn't impressive.

Has anyone read my previous posts? I've specifically said on multiple occasions that modern QB stats can't be compared to those of prior eras. I'm talking about the relative value of a comeback win in 1984 vs. 500 and 4 in 1984, in judging the value of a QB in 1984. I'm saying that the latter goes further to that end. Hence, Marino>>>>>>Elway. I shouldn't need to point out that a 500 and 4 today is much less valuable than one in 1984. As for Brees, we need only to compare him to Manning, who has an equal number of Super Bowls (we don't talk about 2015) and has been passed in most season and career marks by Brees. The main difference between them is that Manning was clearly the dominant QB of most of the 2000s, where Brees has rarely been the undisputed #1 in the league. The only reason I compared him to Elway at all was to state that they included too many QBs from one era and replacing Elway with Brees would balance that out some.