Professional Football Researchers Association Forum

rhickok1109 wrote:I don't know why Ninowski is getting so much love in this thread. In my recollection, he was a somewhat less than mediocre QB who was twice as likely to throw an INT as a TD.

Saban wrote:I didn't mention Vince Costello on the previous post. Costello had been a very good linebacker for the Browns since 1957, but was traded to the Giants during the 1967 preseason. Costello played well for the Giants that year and is one of the big reasons for the Giants upsetting Cleveland and also probably helped New York win some other games in 1967. Never a good idea to trade a good player to a division rival.

In that Giants game: The Cleveland Browns were often accused of being lucky in 1967, but here are some of the things that helped the Giants win that 38 to 34 home game against the Browns:

(1) Giant's punter Koy shanked a punt that hit a Browns player on the side of his leg as he was running up the field to set up a block for Cleveland. The Giants recovered and that seemed to give New York momentum.

(2) A fumbled kickoff by Cleveland gave the Giants an easy touchdown.

(3) Gary Collins had a punt blocked for the first time in his pro career, by a rookie and this gave the Giants another easy 6 points. Collins had been the Browns regular punter since 1962.

(4) Browns great running duo of Leroy Kelly and Ernie Green both were knocked out of the game and Kelly never returned. Turns out that it was Costello who knocked both players out of the game. Vince Costello also made a key interception that led to a Giants TD.

(5) Cleveland could often run almost at will against the Giants weak defense by running sweeps and screen passes, but on the Browns last possession, quarterback Ryan kept trying to throw bombs instead of running the ball. The long passes didn't work and the Giants won the game 38 to 34. Of course, Kelly was out of the game and Green may have been a little shaky.

So, four turnovers and a blocked punt were the story of Cleveland's unlikely loss on that day in 1967. I guess that maybe you could say that the law of averages caught up with the Browns after six straight wins over the New York Giants. Fran Tarkenton was also a factor.

Saban wrote:Vince Costello really had it in for Art Modell and the Cleveland Browns after he was traded to the Giants in 1967. Apparently, he really wanted to win that first Browns/Giants game that year when he went after the teams two star running backs, Leroy Kelly and Ernie Green (I think that Kelly overshadowed Ernie Green, but Green was not only a very good runner and blocker, but he also led the Browns in pass receptions in 1967 with 39 catches). I have heard that Costello knocked both Kelly and Green out of that game with clothesline tackles, and Kelly never returned to the game.

BD Sullivan wrote:

Saban wrote:Vince Costello really had it in for Art Modell and the Cleveland Browns after he was traded to the Giants in 1967. Apparently, he really wanted to win that first Browns/Giants game that year when he went after the teams two star running backs, Leroy Kelly and Ernie Green (I think that Kelly overshadowed Ernie Green, but Green was not only a very good runner and blocker, but he also led the Browns in pass receptions in 1967 with 39 catches). I have heard that Costello knocked both Kelly and Green out of that game with clothesline tackles, and Kelly never returned to the game.

Green got clotheslined early in the game and Kelly got the same treatment with about five minutes left in the game and was kept out the rest of the way. After the game during the postgame handshakes, some of the Browns called Costello on his play. He got the game ball from his teammates and said he got annoyed early in the game when they appeared to be running up the middle, right at him.

Saban wrote:I just started reading a new book called "Blanton's Browns" by Roger Gordon. It is mostly about the Cleveland Browns of the late 1960's.

There are a couple of things that pretty much back up things I have written here about the 1967 Cleveland Browns team.

One is what Head Coach Blanton Collier said after their humiliating 52 to 14 loss in the 1967 playoff game against the Dallas Cowboys. "I tried to be as gracious as I could back in the locker room but I hate to lose," said Collier in the December 26 Plain Dealer (Cleveland newspaper). "I told the boys at the half and after the game that I'm tired of this kind of performance in big games. It happened against Green Bay (Cleveland lost 55 to 7) and it happened again against Dallas. I don't know the answer but we're going to find out. It could mean we need some changes. The Cowboys were up on the bit and came right after us. We didn't respond."

Said an Ohio news reporter, "The '67 Browns turned out to perhaps be the least potent of any of the Browns teams from the time Blanton Collier took over through the end of the decade. They just didn't have many games where they were clearly the superior team. They won several games barely getting by."

I agree with that assessment, but I think that the 1967 Cleveland team was their worst since 1956, which was the only Browns team to ever have a losing record up to that time. Sure, they made the playoffs with a 9 and 5 record, but they played in a very weak division with Cleveland being the only winning team in that division (NFL Century). They only played in three regular season games against teams with winning records out of 14 games, and they got slaughtered against both teams that played in the NFL Championship game. The Browns also struggled against weak teams in a bunch of their wins.

BTW, I highly recommend Roger Gordon's book, "Blanton's Browns."

Saban wrote:

Saban wrote:I just started reading a new book called "Blanton's Browns" by Roger Gordon. It is mostly about the Cleveland Browns of the late 1960's.

There are a couple of things that pretty much back up things I have written here about the 1967 Cleveland Browns team.

One is what Head Coach Blanton Collier said after their humiliating 52 to 14 loss in the 1967 playoff game against the Dallas Cowboys. "I tried to be as gracious as I could back in the locker room but I hate to lose," said Collier in the December 26 Plain Dealer (Cleveland newspaper). "I told the boys at the half and after the game that I'm tired of this kind of performance in big games. It happened against Green Bay (Cleveland lost 55 to 7) and it happened again against Dallas. I don't know the answer but we're going to find out. It could mean we need some changes. The Cowboys were up on the bit and came right after us. We didn't respond."

Said an Ohio news reporter, "The '67 Browns turned out to perhaps be the least potent of any of the Browns teams from the time Blanton Collier took over through the end of the decade. They just didn't have many games where they were clearly the superior team. They won several games barely getting by."

I agree with that assessment, but I think that the 1967 Cleveland team was their worst since 1956, which was the only Browns team to ever have a losing record up to that time. Sure, they made the playoffs with a 9 and 5 record, but they played in a very weak division with Cleveland being the only winning team in that division (NFL Century). They only played in three regular season games against teams with winning records out of 14 games, and they got slaughtered against both teams that played in the NFL Championship game. The Browns also struggled against weak teams in a bunch of their wins.

BTW, I highly recommend Roger Gordon's book, "Blanton's Browns."

Another excerpt from the book "Blanton's Browns" that might interest some:

"The Paul Warfield trade was just one example of the slow downturn that began when Paul Brown was fired by Art Modell. It's a testament to Brown's organization, coaching staff, and player selection that delayed the falloff in production as long as 10 years after his departure. Once Modell's inept decision-making predominated, the Browns' downfall was inevitable."