Professional Football Researchers Association Forum

Dilweg is one of four official PFRA supported HOF senior candidates and I've always agreed with that choice. Not sure the right way to say this, but I just feel Dilweg is more of a slight at his position - I think he pretty easily passes as a top-4 two-way end, whereas I think you have to go deeper to get to Lewellen as a two-way HB.

TanksAndSpartans wrote:Dilweg is one of four official PFRA supported HOF senior candidates and I've always agreed with that choice. Not sure the right way to say this, but I just feel Dilweg is more of a slight at his position - I think he pretty easily passes as a top-4 two-way end, whereas I think you have to go deeper to get to Lewellen as a two-way HB.

Judging by his INT totals, Dilweg appears to have been mainly a defensive back, not an end. Hutson also played split end and D back. If he really was a DE, then oh my God his picks are impressive. Imagine a guy having 5 INTs and like 10+ sacks per season these days. But this seems farfetched.

Lewellen seems to me to have been the best running back of the 20s as far as career output is concerned (Nevers too short), and he certainly had his moments on defense (9 recorded INTs as a rookie). Dilweg did comparatively little on offense; wouldn't say he was the best pass catching end of the 20s, that'd be Johnny Blood. So we'd essentially be inducting a primarily defensive player from the 20s, and that's a bold strategy, Cotton.

Again, if Dilweg was a DE his ballhawking is beyond ridiculous and makes him HOF worthy on its own, but assuming he wasn't (it can't be, right?!), the top 5 two-way ends are definitely Hutson, Pihos, Hewitt, Benton, and Blood, in whatever order you wish. I'd actually have an easier time ranking Lewellen as a top 5 HB because of all the TDs and HBs tended to have short careers, which he did not.

JameisLoseston wrote:

TanksAndSpartans wrote:Dilweg is one of four official PFRA supported HOF senior candidates and I've always agreed with that choice. Not sure the right way to say this, but I just feel Dilweg is more of a slight at his position - I think he pretty easily passes as a top-4 two-way end, whereas I think you have to go deeper to get to Lewellen as a two-way HB.

Judging by his INT totals, Dilweg appears to have been mainly a defensive back, not an end. Hutson also played split end and D back. If he really was a DE, then oh my God his picks are impressive. Imagine a guy having 5 INTs and like 10+ sacks per season these days. But this seems farfetched.

Lewellen seems to me to have been the best running back of the 20s as far as career output is concerned (Nevers too short), and he certainly had his moments on defense (9 recorded INTs as a rookie). Dilweg did comparatively little on offense; wouldn't say he was the best pass catching end of the 20s, that'd be Johnny Blood. So we'd essentially be inducting a primarily defensive player from the 20s, and that's a bold strategy, Cotton.

Again, if Dilweg was a DE his ballhawking is beyond ridiculous and makes him HOF worthy on its own, but assuming he wasn't (it can't be, right?!), the top 5 two-way ends are definitely Hutson, Pihos, Hewitt, Benton, and Blood, in whatever order you wish. I'd actually have an easier time ranking Lewellen as a top 5 HB because of all the TDs and HBs tended to have short careers, which he did not.

Dilweg lined up in the DE position.

JameisLoseston wrote:... the top 5 two-way ends are definitely Hutson, Pihos, Hewitt, Benton, and Blood, in whatever order you wish.

Blood was a halfback, not an end.

JameisLoseston wrote:... the top 5 two-way ends are definitely Hutson, Pihos, Hewitt, Benton, and Blood, in whatever order you wish.

My 4 would be Chamberlin, Dilweg, Hewitt, and Hutson. With Hutson the least well-rounded - GB was happy to get a player they could put at End so Hutson could play DB. Obviously, what he did on offense makes up for a lot and he deserves to be NFL top 100, etc. I'm just saying he wasn't known for defense. Don't forget Pihos played offense and defense in different seasons. There were players playing both ways into the 50s, but given the new substitution rules, I'm hesitant to count those players as two-way players. The 75th Anniversary team disagreed with me on this though.

I think you are way underselling Dilewg with your "stats first" approach. Here are some links on Dilweg:

http://www.profootballresearchers.org/a ... 03-259.pdf

http://www.profootballresearchers.org/L ... _Sheet.pdf

http://www.footballresearch.com/article ... retro.html

Yeah, if he was a primary DE, then I was absolutely underselling him. Coming away with 5-7 INTs a year like he was, at the end position (and that's only the ones we know of!) is absolutely savage, and is something I never could have thought was possible on a consistent basis. What in the world was he doing to be able to pick off so many balls?! Usually a DE getting a pick is pretty fluky, like a tipped pass going to them, but he was doing it on the regular. This takes "all over the field" to a new level, and definitely meets the criterion of historic uniqueness that truly seals a HOF case. He feels like another one of those "didn't get in sooner because the stats just weren't available" guys, like Friedman. Was he the greatest defensive player of the whole two-way era in our opinion? I can't think of anyone who's credited with doing anything quite so impressive.

The Packers' team historian Cliff Christl made a strong case for Lewellen here:

https://www.packers.com/news/verne-lewe ... n-20381335

Pretty convincing as far as I'm concerned.