Professional Football Researchers Association Forum

JuggernautJ wrote:

TanksAndSpartans wrote:

Ronfitch wrote:Good day for Tyreek Hill.

Wonder is his contract had bonuses for both first team and second team AP in the same season.

Doesn't really make sense to me but neither does flex since it isn't actually a position.

This is what happens when Fantasy Football becomes the driving force behind "real" football.

Unfortunately though the popularity of fantasy football is probably a big reason the ratings for the NFL became as huge as it did. A lot of people probably wouldn't be paying much attention to football if it wasn't for their fantasy league.

lastcat3 wrote: Unfortunately though the popularity of fantasy football is probably a big reason the ratings for the NFL became as huge as it did. A lot of people probably wouldn't be paying much attention to football if it wasn't for their fantasy league.

True.
However, for myself, I find Fantasy Football to detract from my enjoyment of the actual game.
I spend more time watching stats and checking scores than watching or studying the games.

But as long as the cash keeps rolling in I won't be changing my ways anytime soon....

JuggernautJ wrote:

lastcat3 wrote: Unfortunately though the popularity of fantasy football is probably a big reason the ratings for the NFL became as huge as it did. A lot of people probably wouldn't be paying much attention to football if it wasn't for their fantasy league.

True.
However, for myself, I find Fantasy Football to detract from my enjoyment of the actual game.
I spend more time watching stats and checking scores than watching or studying the games.

But as long as the cash keeps rolling in I won't be changing my ways anytime soon....

Yep. That is why my fantasy football is the game called Front office football. A simulation computer game that churns out stats and results that are pretty true to life. Getting ready for a playoff game against the Cardinals. Have had the Cards number the past couple years but they may be a bit better here in the 2027 season.

JohnTurney wrote: That is not the tradition, though. Second-teams have been around since the beginning and can serve to reflect if there is a strong set of players at a position over time. Like Ozzie Newsome. His second-team picks were used to show he was a very good player, but was not as noticed as Winslow or Todd Christensen. All-Pro teams, even the first team is nothing more than a plurality vote, same with second-teams

It may be tradition but the system causes many problems. They have been recounted on this forum, and prior versions, many times through the years. Just because something is tradition does not mean it is good. Two recent examples are Tyreek Hill being on both teams and the "2nd team" of a few years ago being quarterback-less.

Instead of 1st and 2nd teams, what is really wrong with a team and then a showing of other guys who got votes for that single team?

If Patrick Mahomes wins the MVP, he will be called the MVP. He won't be called the 1st MVP. If Andrew Luck finishes second in the voting, he will finish second in the voting. It will be on record that he got consideration, but he won't be called 2nd MVP. The same thing could/should be done with the All-Pro team.

Associated Press: "Okay, here it is, folks. We now present to you the All-Pro team. if interested, below you can see all the other players who received votes but not enough to nab a spot on the team."

That's how I did my personal All-NFL team in 2014. I selected a team and then all the other players for whom I felt there could be an argument. Reaser was given a copy. I can produce it if anyone is interested.

How you do the All-Pro team at Pro Football Journal is great. You chose actual 1st and 2nd teams. The Associated Press does not do it like that.

JWL wrote:

JohnTurney wrote: That is not the tradition, though. Second-teams have been around since the beginning and can serve to reflect if there is a strong set of players at a position over time. Like Ozzie Newsome. His second-team picks were used to show he was a very good player, but was not as noticed as Winslow or Todd Christensen. All-Pro teams, even the first team is nothing more than a plurality vote, same with second-teams

It may be tradition but the system causes many problems. They have been recounted on this forum, and prior versions, many times through the years. Just because something is tradition does not mean it is good. Two recent examples are Tyreek Hill being on both teams and the "2nd team" of a few years ago being quarterback-less.

Instead of 1st and 2nd teams, what is really wrong with a team and then a showing of other guys who got votes for that single team?

If Patrick Mahomes wins the MVP, he will be called the MVP. He won't be called the 1st MVP. If Andrew Luck finishes second in the voting, he will finish second in the voting. It will be on record that he got consideration, but he won't be called 2nd MVP. The same thing could/should be done with the All-Pro team.

Associated Press: "Okay, here it is, folks. We now present to you the All-Pro team. if interested, below you can see all the other players who received votes but not enough to nab a spot on the team."

That's how I did my personal All-NFL team in 2014. I selected a team and then all the other players for whom I felt there could be an argument. Reaser was given a copy. I can produce it if anyone is interested.

How you do the All-Pro team at Pro Football Journal is great. You chose actual 1st and 2nd teams. The Associated Press does not do it like that.

Am aware of how the AP does it, but since the beginning, they have chosen to release a 2nd team composed of the second-leading vote-getters. They did omit 2nd teams in 1961 and 1970 and 1971, though, But whatever the negatives, the positives are there, too. My main thing is it's their team and we, as researchers just need to accept whatever it is they do. If PFWA does it differently, then that's their call.

I happen to like 2nd teams being listed because it can explain to less educated fans that good players exist beyond the 1st team, that quality exists in the 2nd or 3rd leading vote-getters.

So, I jsut look at it as it is, and try not to ovethink it. It's a plurality vote, and always has been, and we can pick it apart, which we often do, but it's just one team.

So, folk are certainly welcome to look at it how they wish, I just take it at face value, even with flaws.