More shocking dominant teams: 1981-98 49ers or 2001-19 Patriots

[SeahawkFever]

In 2017, the Eagles came close to starting their own dynasty.

They won that year (would have been changing of the guard), and if Jeffery doesn't drop that pass in NO in the 18 Div. Round, they may have won that game (they would have played the Rams, and they would have been one game away from having a chance to beat NE again).

Then, in 2022, they were ripped off by the officials before winning last year. It could have been four in eight years (and in two different decades) like Golden State.

Also, Seattle had a dynasty shot if they just ran the geekin' ball in SB 49.

As for the Pats, I don't consider them a legit dynasty because of Spygate and shenanigans with the NFL. The Colts, Rams, or Ravens should have been the 2000's dynasty.

Hadn't thought about that for the Eagles; certainly a potential dynasty if a few more things went right.

As for the Seahawks, I'm surprised more people haven't said they should have tried running Russell in at least once.

As for the Pats, is it unfair to say that they would've been one of the better teams in the league for a long time, and maybe won a title or two if the league didn't favor them as consistently as they have?

[7DnBrnc53]

As for the Pats, is it unfair to say that they would've been one of the better teams in the league for a long time, and maybe won a title or two if the league didn't favor them as consistently as they have?

If the league didn't favor them, and would have wanted to find justice, they would have taken away their first three SB wins. Then, Kraft would have had to sell the team, and at least Belichick and Ernie Adams would have been banned (and maybe Brady as well).

Also, they should have been suspended for a year as well. However, the league destroyed the tapes and slapped them on the wrist instead.

[SeahawkFever]

As for the Pats, is it unfair to say that they would've been one of the better teams in the league for a long time, and maybe won a title or two if the league didn't favor them as consistently as they have?

If the league didn't favor them, and would have wanted to find justice, they would have taken away their first three SB wins. Then, Kraft would have had to sell the team, and at least Belichick and Ernie Adams would have been banned (and maybe Brady as well).

Also, they should have been suspended for a year as well. However, the league destroyed the tapes and slapped them on the wrist instead.

Looked up Ernie Adams, apparently he had a long career as an assistant and used a camera that monitored opponent sidelines as part of the footage they collected.

Also, the question I was more so alluding to is: “Could they still have been a good team without Spygate?”

Maybe not a dynasty, but I’d say they could play.

They seemed to have drafted and schemed well, and I’d say the Pats would’ve been one of the better teams in the league for a period of time, even if not the dynasty that they were if the cheating scandals were exposed.

And if a team won multiple titles, I’d consider them a dynasty, so I’d consider the Patriots a dynasty; maybe two if you prefer to split up the 2000’s and 2010’s champs and consider them separate entities.

I understand wanting to take things away from a team because of cheating, or other things that they unfairly benefited from in your view, and it’s certainly useful context to bring up, but the issue I’d have is some people’s cheating is more widely profiled than others.

What’s to say some other team we’d eventually argue in favor of didn’t also benefit from some cheating or at least bad call that has simply been forgotten over time?

By that line of logic the teams that would be the most respected would be the teams whose breaks and cheating has become lost to time.

Case in point, Seahawks fan, and I’ve got to admit that in the 2013 NFC Championship Game we were handed a possession we probably shouldn’t have (I think it was Navarro Bowman that got a fumble recovery they didn’t call)

But that call is mostly forgotten from what I can tell.

[7DnBrnc53]

Looked up Ernie Adams, apparently he had a long career as an assistant and used a camera that monitored opponent sidelines as part of the footage they collected.

It's possible that he was doing things like that in the early-90's when he was with Belichick in Cleveland. Art Modell said that he would give someone 10,000 dollars if they could tell him what Ernie Adams actually did.

If they never did Spygate from day 1 in 2000, though, I think they probably struggle. After NE's Week 1 loss to Tampa in 2000, Patriot OC Charlie Weis went up to Bucs DC Monte Kiffin and basically said that they couldn't beat them despite knowing their plays.

I wonder what the score would have been if they didn't know their plays (they only lost 21-16). The spying may have been helped them stay in practically every game that year (they only lost by more than one possession twice: Against the Jets in Week 7 and Detroit in Week 13 on Thanksgiving).

[SeahawkFever]

Looked up Ernie Adams, apparently he had a long career as an assistant and used a camera that monitored opponent sidelines as part of the footage they collected.

It's possible that he was doing things like that in the early-90's when he was with Belichick in Cleveland. Art Modell said that he would give someone 1,000 dollars if they could tell him what Ernie Adams actually did.

If they never did Spygate from day 1 in 2000, though, I think they probably struggle. After NE's Week 1 loss to Tampa in 2000, Patriot OC Charlie Weis went up to Bucs DC Monte Kiffin and basically said that they couldn't beat them despite knowing their plays.

I wonder what the score would have been if they didn't know their plays (they only lost 21-16). The spying may have been helped them stay in practically every game that year (they only lost by more than one possession twice: Against the Jets in Week 7 and Detroit in Week 13 on Thanksgiving).

I could see that.

Moreover what I was getting at is that they are a team that seems to have been well-ran and well-managed. Transactions, drafting and team building.

Correct me if I'm wrong but would Spygate have anything to do with Belichick's abilities as a GM?

[7DnBrnc53]

Correct me if I'm wrong but would Spygate have anything to do with Belichick's abilities as a GM?

That's a good question. Honestly, I believe it may not because most of the players aren't in on it. The only people that were involved (more than likely) were Bill, Ernie Adams, Brady, and possibly the offensive coordinator.

For example, ex-Patriot LB Ted Johnson would find a list of the other team's audibles in his locker every week. However, he didn't know where it came from. From what I heard, Ernie Adams (the person who probably made that list of audibles) would only speak to Belichick. He never talked to the players.

[7DnBrnc53]

I am looking at the SI 1992 NFL Preview (with Jerry Rice on the cover).

On page 64, there was a section about who the team of the 90's may be (they thought it would be Dallas).

On page 68, there is a graphic that's titled "Will the Pattern Continue". On that graphic, it showed that the Packers, Steelers, 49ers, and Cowboys all had a dismal year in the next to last year of their previous decade, and they hired their HC in the last year of that decade.

When you go by that formula, you know who should have been the team of the 2000's? The Eagles.

They were 3-13 in 1998, and hired Andy Reid (and drafted Donovan McNabb) in 1999. However, shaky drafting by Reid didn't allow this to happen.

[Mark]

I remember when SpyGate was made public some people on the Redskins message boards were joking that this explains how Belichek lost to Spurrier, the Redskins strategy was so nonsensical it confused the Patriots more than it helped.

[Brian wolf]

The things the Patriots did --and got caught doing-- many teams did, it was just a matter of time before someone on different teams --former Belichick disciple Mangini--turned them in.

Ernie Adams had a photographic memory and would break down everything he saw on film and audio and relay back to the coaches. I even heard he could somewhat lipread, to confirm the audibles, signals, etc from opposing QBs and coaches on video breakdown. If they werent cheatin-they werent tryin ...

[7DnBrnc53]

Here is a good article that talks about Spygate and Deflategate:

https://www.espn.com/espn/otl/story/_/i ... iots-apart