Double-thread: Favre vs Rodgers; Cowher vs Tomlin

[74_75_78_79_]

Aaron still has some more years as a starting QB to go before he fully catches up to Brett longevity-wise. But with #12 already having had himself quite a lengthy career - and each having themselves a Ring - it perhaps is not too premature to warrant such a thread even if Aaron never makes it to...'season 19'.

Same with Tomlin still not having the years in the 'Burgh as Cowher (13 seasons to 15 respectively), such a thread can already be in order as well. Each 1-1 in the Super Bowl itself, Cowher's still got two more playoff berths over Tomlin (10 to 8), but Tomlin still not suffering a losing season yet (quite a notable)! I'm sensing that Mike will forever be underrated!

[sluggermatt15]

I think Mike's had better talent to work with and he's underachieved based on it. He's had Ben for most of his career, Troy Polamalu, Antonio Brown, et al. Hasn't been to the Big Game since 2010. You could argue the defense was better under Cowher and I agree. But the game has changed to more pass happy and it took the Steelers a while to catch up. The results in the playoffs just haven't been there with Ben, who has just about all the passing records in Steelers history. What are the odds the Steelers draft another guy like him?

[Crazy Packers Fan]

I live in Pittsburgh and I'm a Packers fan, so I consider myself qualified on both topics

No one was tougher than Brett Favre, and few were as fun to watch. You never knew what was about to happen with him, whether he'd make one of the plays of the year or throw a pick-six. As for Aaron Rodgers, he has specific skill sets that he's better at, such as the "shot" play, or Hail Mary plays, or getting a free play. I admit that watching Rodgers is more relaxing, because he's likely not going to throw an interception. With Favre, you never knew what you were going to get, but it was sure to be exciting.

Who do I like more? If you asked me in 2015, I'd say Rodgers in a heartbeat. Now I'm not so sure. I've become tired of watching Rodgers come up short in big games. All four of his NFC Championship Games have been miserable performances for the most part. In 2016 and 2019, it was as if he didn't even show up. And I know the Rodgers "GOAT" fans would blame the defense, but if he's the "GOAT," then how about what Patrick Mahomes did last year with the defense spotting opponents big leads? Plain and simple, Rodgers is not even in the same league as Tom Brady, the guy all the "GOAT" people try to compare him with.

Rodgers still has a chance to prove his worth, but if he never makes another Super Bowl, then I'll favor Favre forever.

As for Bill Cowher vs. Mike Tomlin, I see things the opposite way of most Steelers fans. They will tell you that Tomlin has underachieved with greater talent. But what then do you say about Cowher's consistency in getting to Honolulu? Cowher went to four Pro Bowls, which is not a good thing as a head coach. That means that he lost four AFC Championship Games - 1994, 1997, 2001, 2004 - all at home.

So, I'd take Tomlin over Cowher, especially given the fact that he managed to hold a team together that had malcontents in Antonio Brown and Le'Veon Bell. If Ben Roethlisberger gets back to form, I fully expect another Super Bowl before his career is over.

[PigskinDispatch]

I can't tell you who was better between Favre and Rodgers but I think we can all agree that they were/are both fun to watch play the game in their respective styles of slinging the ball around.

As a Steelers fan since the early 70's, both Tomlin and Cowher were in charge of their teams and their players loved them for the most part. As the earlier poster indicated Tomlin has not had a losing season while at the helm. That speaks volumes.

[74_75_78_79_]

Both of these are so damn tough which only further exemplifies why this is a warranted double-thread in the first place!

Even if the response is, simply, that you can't compare due to contrasting styles, then that's fine as well. And that is mostly the case with Favre and Rodgers! Style-wise, I'd have to go with Brett! I think most football-fans agree. His plays-like-a-linebacker/fearlessly butting-heads-with and trash-talk-exchanging with the likes of Warren Sapp (earning MUCH respect from those very likes), his gun-slinging ways...(I mean, didn't we all love Bradshaw for that)...but early on his being prone to the here-and-there costly INT wasn't so much the case. He was the best QB in the league for at least three-straight years from '95-thru-'97 which just so happen to be his three-consecutive All Pro years! Not just 'style'-wise but as an overall QB he basically, already 'clinched' Canton by the end of that run even if its final game was a SB-loss. Rodgers may have arguably been the best in the NFL during his, so far, peak-time; but that's "arguably". Brett, '95-thru-'97, was without argument! And he, indeed, had some HOF-to-be peers at that position as well during that time!

At the time Aaron won SBXLV against my Steelers, and the immediate years that followed, it seemed like #12 was already going to..."surpass" #4 "anytime" now! But just as you state, CPF, such a GOAT/better-than-Favre 'aura' may have faded in the time since; he now being stuck in Drew Brees-mode with just one Ring, with many more left on the table thus far. I'm simply going to have to go with Brett overall for now (and, again, not just 'style'-wise). Rodgers still has time to catch-up and even surpass, but IMO he's not there just yet.

And it actually isn't all about...longevity. Not at all! Aaron is entering his 16th season this year albeit this being his 13th as a starter. Favre's 16th season had him lead his team to a 13-3 finish and hosting the NFCC. 17th season, despite the eventual 1-4 collapse (ultimately, in the finale, to a team that finished 1-15 the year before), he had NYJ heavily flirt with a strong playoff-finish by beating both the Pats and then the top-seed-to-be Titans in Wks #11 & 12 respectively - both on the road, mind you! 18th season was perhaps his best-ever immediately elevating the Vikings to a 1st-Rd bye and then on the cusp of their first SB-berth since '76! Now, yes, there are critiques in each case of he not finishing the deal, but simply the fact he brought each team to that flirtation-point in the first place whereas likely no one else would have! Yes, Aaron has those three seasons to compete with in his next three seasons before making it to...Season 19! Stay tuned!! I guess a 2nd Lombardi in that time ought to at least forge 'victory'.


Cowher vs Tomlin...pretty tough for this, here, Steeler-fan! Tougher to opine than the previous! Yes, Bill took over a team that was "signed/sealed" to be a contender already! Maybe if Noll would have stuck around in '92, he would have brought the 'Burgh back to the playoffs with a vengeance as well! We'll never truly know, but it basically reeked of "time for new blood in the system" and Cowher was what the Dr ordered after all with that (albeit, a bit quasi-paper-tiger-ish) right-out-the-gate Top-Seed campaign! And if a "letdown"/"sophmore-jinx" is still making the playoffs albeit 9-7 but bringing 'Joe Cool' into OT on the road...then a "letdown"/"SJ" it was! Although it should still not be mistaken for a 'record' (Paul Brown...TEN-straight realistically), he did lead his team to the playoffs in each of his first six seasons as a HC (yes, maybe/maybe-not John Robinson seven-straight if not for '87)!

Many trips to Honolulu? Yes, but better doing that than NOT doing that! Yes, Neil O with his historically low INT-%age going into SBXXX (better QB for us than Phil Simms IMO), and Kordell having regular season moments (and Tommy Maddox's 2002 one-hit-wonder), Bill never really had a marquee QB! And many players both on offense and defense along with assistant coaches being cherry-picked year-in, year-out...Yet (brief '98-thru-'00 hiatus aside) he almost always brought excitement to the 'Burgh with regular contenders! Big Ben comes along - problem SOLVED - he finally raises up that long-allusive Lombardi!

'94 AFCC? Yes, can't defend it all too much. Steelers were the overall more talented team on both sides of ball. They very likely give SF a much better game if not, actually, beat them! It's not like Bobby Ross was a longtime great HC and simply took advantage of Cowher's "newness" to being in a big game! But Bobby IMO turns out to be an historically underrated NFL HC thus out-chess-ing Bill in this particular event is a key example of that. Some of his later work with Detroit exemplifies that as well. Yes, Cowher still should have overcame (and, in this game, he can't blame O'Donnell), but Bobby simply stepped-up even more! Losing was, indeed, pretty bad (my worst Steeler-memory ever; even more than SBXXX to...Dallas) but not an ultra-serious felony. Denver in '97? Come on! Broncos were a Top-Seed in disguise of a wild card (they 'allowed' the Burgh - and Forty Niners - to beat them in the regular season)! Broncos would prove it even more the following year! And those damn home-affairs in '01 & '04? We're talking Bill Belichick and Tom Brady!!

Tomlin got to have Big Ben all the rest of the time. He had great defenses all throughout as well, but perhaps not as great of defenses as Cowher did. But at least he had Big Ben the whole time (as he was quickly peaking)! So, it's kind-of even-Steven between both! Had Cowher stayed around, likely he wins at least another Lombardi. But I SO can't help but feel that the Steelers' '08 SB-triumph was SO much more Tomlin than simply a 'product' of two-years-removed from Cowher. Bill may have won his second Vince another year, but feel it would have NOT been in '08. SBXLIII had Mike Tomlin written ALL OVER it IMHO!

I will ALWAYS place the Emperor far above BOTH and that, of course (FOUR-out-of-Four Rings), is nothing to EVER be ashamed of!! Tomlin does have these next two years to make the playoffs thus tying Cowher for playoff berths by 'Year 15'! If he can accomplish that, after that, it'll be up to he to 'win' the he-vs-Cowher 'sweepstakes'.

[usfltecmo]

Favre vs. Rodgers is very difficult. I've chewed on this one ever since you posted it earlier this week.

Favre has durability on his side, and he also came into a situation where winning hadn't been a frequent occurrence, to say the least. Rodgers got the benefit of coming into a far more stable organization, with a winning tradition having been re-established. Favre can be directly tied to bringing winning back to Green Bay. Beyond his play, his toughness (playing through a separated shoulder after a hit by White in a late season game in 1992) was an element that attracted Reggie White when Reggie stunned the NFL by going to Green Bay during free agency, and made Green Bay a more attractive destination right as free agency was expanded after years of labor disputes.

On the other hand, Favre was a lot more up and down in his performances in the playoffs, and can be directly tied to some of the more painful losses, especially later in his career, where Rodgers hasn't had as many fingers pointed in his direction after playoff losses, and might be even more highly regarded if he'd have had a bit more luck in the close ones. There are a few games where the defense and special teams have caved in late and cost the team dearly. Rodgers has also been the catalyst for a bunch of late game comebacks and put up some big numbers in the playoffs, where Favre was able to rely on big team efforts during his more successful days in the 90s.

It's a good problem to have.

[sluggermatt15]

I'm a Steelers fan also. I don't feel Tomlin won with Cowher's players in 2008. It was a great coaching job by him. That Steelers defense was tough. The offense had the right balance of run and pass. Willie Parker was one of the great one-shot wonders. I think Cowher may have had a better control over the locker room. It seems like Tomlin, less so, with all the AB, Martavis Bryant, et al nonsense going on.

Personally, I don't think Cowher is a Hall-of-Fame coach. But if you put him in, you have to put Tomlin in, because he's never had a losing season, he has a higher winning %, and will pass Cowher in franchise wins. He might even get close to or pass Noll, depending on how he performs over the next few seasons. Tomlin is just like Cowher, he does not have to worry about his job security. There is no way the Steelers fire him.

[JWL]

Steelers all the way. I mean, c'mon.