Encyclopedia of Armed Forces Football

[oldecapecod11]

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Encyclopedia of Armed Forces Football
Started by Mark L. Ford, Sep 10 2014 02:11 PM

7 replies to this topic

#1 Mark L. Ford
Administrators
Posted 10 September 2014 - 02:11 PM
Congratulations to PFRA member John Daye on an amazing volume, more than a decade in the making. I received my copy of this today, after having pre-ordered it during the PFRA meeting in June, and it's the best coverage I've seen of the service football teams, which were big in three eras coinciding with war. A lot of people are familiar with the ones that played during World War Two (1942-1945), since these were appearing in the wire service polls along with colleges. However, these were also big stuff during WW I and the early 1950s during the Korean War. Quite a few NFL players were literally drafted into the organization and played service ball, and getting paid to do it as part of their regular salary, and CBS televised a Sunday game of the week during some years, well before it did regular season NFL games.

#2 mwald
PFRA Member
Posted 10 September 2014 - 03:54 PM
This looks like a very interesting book. Will have to check it out.

#3 Jeffrey Miller
PFRA Member
Posted 10 September 2014 - 05:11 PM
Is this the one Marv Levy wrote the foreword for?

#4 luckyshow
Forum Visitors
This does sound like a fun book. Where does one order it?

Service teams were also early ones to integrate:
http://www.luckyshow.../FtHamilton.htm

#5 Mark L. Ford
Administrators
Posted 10 September 2014 - 07:58 PM
It's a St. Johann Press release-- I couldn't find their catalog, but here's the Amazon lizting. Charley Trippi wrote the introduction.
http://www.amazon.co...e/dp/1937943216

#6 Massimo Foglio
PFRA Member
Posted 26 September 2014 - 05:05 AM
This look to be a very interesting read and an additional soirce fordoing more research on service football in Europe too.

#7 John Grasso
Board of Directors
Posted 26 September 2014 - 07:24 AM
Mark L. Ford, on 10 Sept 2014 - 7:58 PM, said:
It's a St. Johann Press release-- I couldn't find their catalog, but here's the Amazon lizting. Charley Trippi wrote the introduction.
http://www.amazon.co...e/dp/1937943216

They were at the PFRA meeting in Cleveland. Their website is http://www.stjohannp...s/about_us.html
I spoke with David Biesel in Cleveland but he never told me about his staff - details in the about us section of his website.

#8 Moran
PFRA Member
Posted 06 October 2014 - 03:05 PM
Thanks for the heads up on this book - picked up a copy and have found it very useful. I've been trying to find more information about the teams from Great Lakes Naval Training - his account of the Great Lakes vs Navy Academy game was priceless. One magazine I found recently had a picture of the 1917 team

[Mark L. Ford]

Daye had an interesting theory, which was that the popularity of non-collegiate football during World War One convinced Halas and other investors that a professional football league could be successfully organized after the war. I hadn't ever seen that idea advanced, but it's plausible.

[luckyshow]

For no particular reason I will present a few related pages.
The first is the first team Charles Brickley coached. Almost all U.S. service personnel shipped out from here, including the Rainbow Brigade.
http://www.luckyshow.org/football/HobokenTransport.htm

A couple more. Quantico must be an interesting history.
http://www.luckyshow.org/football/Missile%20Bowl.htm

Here's a silly one. I wonder how many players got ill.
http://www.luckyshow.org/football/Atom%20Bowl.htm

Willet's Point had a service academy and holds the first tunnels constructed in the New York region. Also, note it was an actual location where Fort Totten is/was. The area near Shea Stadium was named for the road to Willets Point that passes by near where Shea Stadium was. The LIR and subway used the name for their stops...
http://www.luckyshow.org/football/WilletsPoint.htm

I have never found another listed game for the USS Amphitrite, and the images don't usually work, but the page is interesting for the military history
http://www.luckyshow.org/Amazing/Amphitrite.htm

To bore you even more silly:
http://www.luckyshow.org/football/Grani ... talion.htm
http://www.luckyshow.org/football/Company%20I.htm

The Silk Stocking Brigade (the Knickerbocker Brigade):
http://www.luckyshow.org/football/7thRegNYNG.htm

http://www.luckyshow.org/football/FlushingMilitia.htm

Speaking of the Rainbow Brigade; that would be Camp Mills:
http://www.luckyshow.org/football/MitchelFld.htm

This one is unfinished (well, most could be considered unfinished):
http://www.luckyshow.org/football/Troop%20F.htm

http://www.luckyshow.org/football/NYMaritime.htm

[oldecapecod11]

lucky... the 2nd link...

Satellite Bowl
Cocoa, Florida
Satellite Bowl 1957 Fort Carson (W 12-6) Fort Dix, (12/29)

Do you have a program for that game? If so, does it list Rosey Grier?
Grier played for Fort Dix in 1957.

[oldecapecod11]

Great link, lucky!

I bet some people wonder? Unless thay have seen them - INSIDE is best - folks have no clue as to how big
these regimental armories are in The City. Many, if not most, take up an entire city block.
In most cases, they are about 300 feet long (usually N-S) and 750-1000 feet wide (E-W.)
They are definitely worth the look if someone is fortunate enough to visit New York City -
especially the 69th Regiment Armory. Yes, my friends, The Fightin' 69th.

7th Regiment Armory
New York National Guard
Seventh Regiment Armory
Park Avenue & 66th Strret, New York City

[rhickok1109]

Great link, lucky!

I bet some people wonder? Unless thay have seen them - INSIDE is best - folks have no clue as to how big
these regimental armories are in The City. Many, if not most, take up an entire city block.
In most cases, they are about 300 feet long (usually N-S) and 750-1000 feet wide (E-W.)
They are definitely worth the look if someone is fortunate enough to visit New York City -
especially the 69th Regiment Armory. Yes, my friends, The Fightin' 69th.

7th Regiment Armory
New York National Guard
Seventh Regiment Armory
Park Avenue & 66th Strret, New York City

I think that's something like 25 city blocks, isn't it?

[Mark L. Ford]

Great link, lucky!

I bet some people wonder? Unless thay have seen them - INSIDE is best - folks have no clue as to how big
these regimental armories are in The City. Many, if not most, take up an entire city block.
In most cases, they are about 300 feet long (usually N-S) and 750-1000 feet wide (E-W.)
They are definitely worth the look if someone is fortunate enough to visit New York City -
especially the 69th Regiment Armory. Yes, my friends, The Fightin' 69th.

7th Regiment Armory
New York National Guard
Seventh Regiment Armory
Park Avenue & 66th Strret, New York City

I think that's something like 25 city blocks, isn't it?

Not 25 city blocks, but the equivalent of five or six football fields....

[oldecapecod11]

by rhickok1109 » Fri Nov 07, 2014 9:26 am
oldecapecod 11 wrote:
Great link, lucky!
I bet some people wonder? Unless thay have seen them - INSIDE is best - folks have no clue as to how big
these regimental armories are in The City. Many, if not most, take up an entire city block.
In most cases, they are about 300 feet long (usually N-S) and 750-1000 feet wide (E-W.)
They are definitely worth the look if someone is fortunate enough to visit New York City -
especially the 69th Regiment Armory. Yes, my friends, The Fightin' 69th.
7th Regiment Armory
New York National Guard
Seventh Regiment Armory
Park Avenue & 66th Strret, New York City

I think that's something like 25 city blocks, isn't it?

No, Ralph. You may be thinking of what is known as a "superblock" and, depending on the city,
these can be rather HUGE.
In Boston, for example, the Prudential Center might be considered a superblock. They eliminated the streets
from Mass Ave to Copley Square and created one big "block." But, if juxtaposed by, say, Berkely to Kenmore
along Comm Ave, it probably would not cover 25 city blocks. Using the formila offered, 25 city blocks might be
300' Long by 18,750' Wide on the short side or, using the rare 1,000, 300 by 25,000. Heck, there are towns
that aren't that big.
Think about that place in Maine where they argued for years whether the population was 21 or 22 and it took
the traffic laws of Great Britain to settle the matter.
Ha! I see your echo. I'll get to that later.

[luckyshow]

I don't have program for Satellite Bowl.

As to Fort Dix football. As I may have stated before, for some reason, the military never saved (except for the Great War, a few), any base publications. All are gone. Except Fort Monmouth, and I hope they saved them when they recently moved and closed Ft. Monmouth. Many were wrapped in butcher paper at the old Marconi house attic at closed Camp Grant south of Red Bank, way south. (Red Bank is where Fort Monmouth was, Camp Grant was an attached outpost that was a former research facility/hotel of Marconi turned into a military installation around WWII)

Anyway I once was contacted by a woman who saved many Fort Dix periodicals but I never could get to her location and now have lost the contact information. Whatever I have of Fort Dix probably comes from information I have for Mitchel Field which I got from local Long Island newspapers. And similar sources. It has always pissed me off that I can't locate almost any of the old base publications. Why they saved almost every soldiers' toothbrushes but not these is maddening! So Fort Hamilton has a museum but only knows the name of the publication, and has nothing. This is why I have virtually nothing for teams from Governors Island. (Fort Jay). Near Brooklyn but part of New York County (Manhattan), so was never much reported on. Brooklyn papers ignored them and Manhattan ones had better things to do. I am still wondering which New Jersey local paper may have reported Fort Hancock games. The Fort Monmouth papers only went back to late 1940s, but I was able to find a lot from 1930s in Red Bank local paper. Fort Hamilton from Brooklyn newspapers (there were four dailies, even more before the 30s), Fort Totten from Flushing dailies. Another I have not enough for was Fort Slocum, on an island off of New Rochelle. Westchester papers were old fashioned broadsheets which ignored most sports, and if in a Connecticut paper from Greenwich or Stamford, I can't say. Bridgeport rarely mentioned them. I apologize for not saving roster info. It is hard enough collecting what I do find. I look for basketball and other sports, too!!

I should get home now and view the Jets and Giants getting schlonked....

[oldecapecod11]

by luckyshow » Sun Nov 09, 2014 2:36 pm
"I don't have program for Satellite Bowl..."


Paul,
You might wanna try this guy?
If he is no longer at Fort Dix, you can write or e-mail him c/o his publisher.
Usually, they will forward.
Daniel W. Zimmerman, curator of the Fort Dix Museum, has been researching and writing
the history of Fort Dix for more than fifteen years.
ARCADIA PUBLISHING COMPANY CONTACT INFORMATION
CORPORATE OFFICE
420 Wando Park Blvd.
Mount Pleasant, SC 29464
(843) 853-2070
(843) 853-0044 fax
http://www.arcadiapublishing.com/authors

Now, concerning your comment re the "jingle," this poster tells the world of their ALE
and not a word about beer.